Mr. Liberal says:
Wow! That’s the biggest list of crap I’ve ever read. You people call yourselves Christians? I’m sure Christ said that only he who is without sin should cast the first stone and not to judge unless you’re ready to be judged yourself. You people aren’t pro-life, you’re anti-woman. According to you a rape victim should be forced to carry her rapists baby; that’s real Christ like. Good God, you people have some real studying of the bible to do.
The following is what I replied to and I will also continue by adding what it is common to hear if you are part of the pro-life community and have discussed our views with those who believe differently.
pro-life expert says:
The following is what I replied to and I will also continue by adding what it is common to hear if you are part of the pro-life community and have discussed our views with those who believe differently.
pro-life expert says:
@ Mr. Liberal: First off, I am a woman, so how can a woman be anti-woman. I went to a lecture of Scott Klusendorf’s over the summer. He is a brilliant man who is an expert in bio-ethics and author of The Case for Life. The first and foremost thing that I will address is that rather than refute the pro-life stance, you attack the person them self and deem them someone who is “anti-woman.” So what exactly does that mean if it is a woman advocating the pro-life stance. Although Christ did say let he who is with out sin cast the first stone, he also said to tell your brother that they are in sin or you will be responsible for that sin. (Its in Ephesians) Also, you can hate the sin and love the sinner. The sinner needs prayers too. I am pro-choice when it comes to where a woman works, what she does at her job, what she wears, etc. except when it impedes upon the life of another human being. Whether that means that she murders someone else in society or her unborn child. The rapist ought to be charged with the full extent of the law. However, it is not a matter of how the child came to be but instead a question of what the child is. Greg Koukl said that if the unborn is not human, no justification is necessary for elective abortion, but if the unborn is human, no justification is adequate for elective abortion. At the point of conception, the pre-born is not a gamete but instead a whole, distinct, living human being called a zygote. The law of biogenesis states that life comes from other life and that like creates like meaning that I (a human) cannot produce puppies. The only difference between the zygote you were then and the person you are now (and this applies to anyone who can read this, is known as an acronym known as S.L.E.D. meaning that the only thing that differs is Size, Level of development, Environment, and Degree of dependency. You were not the size you are now the moment you were born. What is the difference between a tiny zygote and an infant? A toddler is less developed than a full grown woman, but does that mean that we can kill it? I’m not entirely sure about you, but when I leave a room, I don’t change into something or someone else. What makes a child that has moved through the 6 to 8 inches through the birth canal any different from one that has not. There are different degrees of dependency throughout life. A child depend on its mother and father until it is a legal adult (and then sometimes after that). What is the difference between an infant that is dependent on its mother and a pre-born that is dependent on its mother?
Alright, so let's look at what Mr. Liberal had to say...
First, note that he has not refuted the pro-life position (as many pro-choice people fail to do), but has instead chosen to personally attack the person making the claim. For instance, during an HBO special, comedian Rosanne Barr told the audience: "You know who else I can't stand is them people that are antiabortion....I hate them. They're ugly, old, geeky, hideous men. They just don't want nobody to have an abortion, cause they want you to keep spitting out kids so they can molest them."
So according to Rosanne, I am an ugly, old, geeky, hideous man because I am against abortion. Anybody see how that is completely untrue. I am a 17 year old young woman, who although I tend to be somewhat of a nerd, is not in any way an old man that wants to have women keep spitting out kids that I can molest.
Instead of defending the abortion act itself, some "pro-choice" advocates personally attack those who do not share their views. At a 1995 "Rock for Choice" concert in Pensacola Florida, vocalist Eddie Vedder of Pearl Jam shrieked from the stage: "I'm usually good about my temper, but all these men trying to control women's bodies really piss me off. They're talking from a bubble. They're not talking from the street, and they're not in touch with what's real. Well, I'm f----ing mean, and I'm ugly, and my name is reality. Music--that is my religion. I would never force my beliefs on anyone--that's the thing."
Again, Eddie Vedder is assuming (my grandpa always told me never to assume because I make something out of u and me) that I am a man who is unable to see what is real. However, he could not deviate further from the truth. I believe we have already established my gender. And what I see as "real" entails the fact that as a country we will help those from Burma because they are already born, yet we will not defend life in its most pure state. This person attack that people use to silence pro-lifers is called the ad hominem fallacy.
One thing that I addressed that many people are on the borderline between pro-life and pro-choice is rape. As I stated above, it is not a matter of how the child came to be, but of what the child is. If it is not human, no justification for killing it is necessary. However, if it is human, no justification is acceptable for killing the innocent child.
Another thing that comes up often is "We don't know when human life begins." However, as Scott puts it, we should remain on the side of caution. He says that if we see what looks like a coat lying in the middle of the road but there is a chance that there is a homeless person under the coat, that we would swerve in order to be cautious.
Lastly, I wanted to say that there is going to be a Teens for Life at our school. I am in charge of it. I am looking at Halloween as the first meeting. If you are interested but cannot attend, please let me know or contact Mr. Panning, as he is the club sponsor.
Alright, so let's look at what Mr. Liberal had to say...
First, note that he has not refuted the pro-life position (as many pro-choice people fail to do), but has instead chosen to personally attack the person making the claim. For instance, during an HBO special, comedian Rosanne Barr told the audience: "You know who else I can't stand is them people that are antiabortion....I hate them. They're ugly, old, geeky, hideous men. They just don't want nobody to have an abortion, cause they want you to keep spitting out kids so they can molest them."
So according to Rosanne, I am an ugly, old, geeky, hideous man because I am against abortion. Anybody see how that is completely untrue. I am a 17 year old young woman, who although I tend to be somewhat of a nerd, is not in any way an old man that wants to have women keep spitting out kids that I can molest.
Instead of defending the abortion act itself, some "pro-choice" advocates personally attack those who do not share their views. At a 1995 "Rock for Choice" concert in Pensacola Florida, vocalist Eddie Vedder of Pearl Jam shrieked from the stage: "I'm usually good about my temper, but all these men trying to control women's bodies really piss me off. They're talking from a bubble. They're not talking from the street, and they're not in touch with what's real. Well, I'm f----ing mean, and I'm ugly, and my name is reality. Music--that is my religion. I would never force my beliefs on anyone--that's the thing."
Again, Eddie Vedder is assuming (my grandpa always told me never to assume because I make something out of u and me) that I am a man who is unable to see what is real. However, he could not deviate further from the truth. I believe we have already established my gender. And what I see as "real" entails the fact that as a country we will help those from Burma because they are already born, yet we will not defend life in its most pure state. This person attack that people use to silence pro-lifers is called the ad hominem fallacy.
One thing that I addressed that many people are on the borderline between pro-life and pro-choice is rape. As I stated above, it is not a matter of how the child came to be, but of what the child is. If it is not human, no justification for killing it is necessary. However, if it is human, no justification is acceptable for killing the innocent child.
Another thing that comes up often is "We don't know when human life begins." However, as Scott puts it, we should remain on the side of caution. He says that if we see what looks like a coat lying in the middle of the road but there is a chance that there is a homeless person under the coat, that we would swerve in order to be cautious.
Lastly, I wanted to say that there is going to be a Teens for Life at our school. I am in charge of it. I am looking at Halloween as the first meeting. If you are interested but cannot attend, please let me know or contact Mr. Panning, as he is the club sponsor.
Why would you choose to put quotations around the words pro-choice? What is there about that group that does not condone exactly what the name means, as is usually implied by the use of quotation marks? And as to the use of personal attacks, this is a tactic I see used in equal amounts, if not more, by the "pro-life" movement. (See, this is the correct use of quotation marks, since my preferred term for the "pro-life" movement is anti-choice.) Slanderous terms such as 'slut' and 'murderer' are routinely thrown at those who chose to have an abortion and those who support that choice. And you are using a select few examples to discredit a whole movement. Many pro-choice activists mention men, as they are the majority of the “pro-life” movement. In the same way, "pro-life" activists mention only women but do not include men who support the cause and those who are not cis-gendered. Your arguments would also be more effective if they were based on verifiable, statistical, scientific information rather than opinions and anecdotes.
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